vision2020
RE: Democracy or Republic
"founding fathers did not trust the public to make the right decisions"
That is a pretty bold statment. I don't remember leaning that in
U.S. History.
John Cavalieri
jcaval@uidaho.edu
__________________________________________________________________________
On Thu, 14 Dec 2000, Shahab Mesbah wrote:
> Dearest friends,
>
> I certainly agree with many of Susan's points. However, I must disagree with
> her analysis of the Electoral College. I find it offensive to live in a
> state that dictates what my political choice is. The Electoral College is
> exactly that. Since I live in Idaho and Idaho is as a whole republican then
> my vote in this state is meaningless. You talk about the fact that everyone
> does not vote... if you are in Idaho and you do not want to vote republican
> you are wasting your vote... your vote is meaningless. The state has a
> certain number of electoral votes determined by its population. The populous
> states will have the same amount of pull without the Electoral College as
> they do now. The only difference will be that EVERY vote will count. So, if
> you voted for Bush and you lived in a democratic state... your vote would
> count... now it does not. The Electoral College was put into place because
> the founding fathers did not trust the public to make the right decisions.
> In those days the communications and education of the public was not as well
> developed. The Electoral College is an antiquated idea. It is the main
> reason why the system we have in this wonderful country is so very
> unpopular. It is at the root of apathy in our beloved country.
>
> I agree that neither candidate was great. I disliked the Electoral College
> when Regan became president and I hated it just as much when Clinton was
> elected and I would have hated it if Gore were the next president. My views
> transcend partisan politics for I believe that partisan politics is
> inherently evil! Partisan politics is based on the same idiotic principles
> as "fundamentalist religion". It is a way to generalize and exclude others
> who do not exactly meet our mold. It is the easy way... it is a way without
> thought... without ethics... without justice... and mostly without respect
> for Truth. The fact is that most Americans are not either one... we are
> somewhere in the middle. So why even bother with such an idiotic method of
> branding opinions?
>
> Your brother in arms,
>
> Shahab...
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mark Rounds [mailto:ltrwritr@moscow.com]
> Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2000 12:41 PM
> To: WMSteed@aol.com; vision2020@moscow.com
> Cc: bwolf@moscow.com
> Subject: Re: Democracy or Republic
>
> Good Morning!
>
> I have been reading the vitriolic messages bouncing back and forth about the
> recent presidential election, and had to send in my two cents.
>
> First of all, I was enamored with none of the candidates. I thought they
> held too much to strict party doctrine and offered little to the independent
> voter. Instead of either party choosing a candidate that would draw the
> independent vote, each party chose from the loyal party ranks and then tried
> to market their man to draw the independent vote. Sorry, but I honestly
> beleive people are smart enought to recognize marketing when they see it.
>
> Secondly, given the dismal choice of candidates this year, the fact that one
> vote in this household went to Nader was not a sign the vote was `stolen' as
> that vote would NEVER have been cast for Gore. Sorry, but that was strictly
> cast as a protest vote against ANY of the party faithful.
>
> Finally, please think carefully about following quote regarding the
> electoral college:
>
> >
> > Whereas the prospect of electing to office a President and
> >
> >Vice President who did not win the largest number of popular votes has
> >
> >generated proposals calling for a constitutional amendment to provide
> >
> >for the direct popular election of the President and Vice President.
> >
> >
> > Whereas such a national popular election for President and
> >
> >Vice President disregards the constitutional integrity and inviolability
> >
> >of the 50 states as independent and sovereign governments;
> >
> >
> > Whereas in their foresight and wisdom, the people of the
> >
> >United States, meeting by representation in State conventions, adopted a
> >
> >national Constitution preserving the independence and equal standing of
> >
> >the 50 states;
> >
> >
> > Whereas the Federal system of equal and independent states
> >
> >is an essential safeguard against shifting wills of the majority
> >
> >overriding the unchanging rights of the minority;
> >
> >
> > Whereas to preserve the rights of the minority from a
> >
> >tyranny of the majority, the Constitution of the United States struck a
> >
> >principled balance between the people of the most populous States and
> >
> >the people of the least populous States.
> >
>
>
> We live in a sparsely populated, western state. Do we really want to give
> up the electoral college and allow all elections to be decided by the
> populations of California, Texas and the states of the Eastern Seaboard?
> Frankly I got suspicious when Hillary Rodham Clinton said she would be very
> willing to sponsor a bill abolishing the electoral college as one of her
> first acts in Congress.
>
> I am an optimist, because I think the system still functions as it was
> intended, at least for the most part. The arguments regarding dishonesty
> of the election are not new, have surfaced with many close elections. But
> remember the number of states where votes were tallied without a hitch, and
> think of all the electoral districts without problems. I also think that
> this will never happen agaiin in Florida, for whatever reason you care to
> imagine. Maybe another state, another year, but never again in Florida.
>
> I am jaded by Federal elections. First of all, we have little say about the
> candidates that will pass the primary level. Heck, this year the
> Presidential candidates were decided before we ever got to our Primary!
> Secondly, they talk about a 49.% vs. 49% split of the votiing population
> and we have endless queries about the will of the `majority'. I am sorry,
> but 49% of the 60% or so that voted does not constitute any `majority' of
> the people in this country.
>
> Finally, I dislike public posturing, name calling, endless legal
> manipulation and so forth. It seems both main parties are equally guilty in
> this. In my mind the best man in the Presidential election would have been
> the one that said `This is a null contest, the majority of the American
> People have cast their vote for NOBODY, including me, so I withdraw" The
> irony would be we'd be left with the worst of the possiblities!
>
> Since I liked none of the available candidates and I am a member of neither
> party, I have no political ax to grind. But I do wish to express my sincere
> gratitude that the electoral college does exist, and offer my heartfelt
> thanks to the courteous and honorable people that do run for office, at
> whatver level!
>
> Susan Rounds
>
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