vision2020
Re: Levy Comments
To Shahab:
In the postscript to your comments on Moscow education, you said you were
"signing off" this forum.
(I assume you mean you are unsubscribing and will no longer either read or
comment to the V2020 dialog)
Well, that is a drag.
I am sorry that you are removing yourself in that way. (perhaps you could
continue to subscribe and limit your comment time)
I have appreciated your perspectives and your willingness to share them.
BL
Shahab Mesbah wrote:
> Ok... I will bite!
>
> I have been a great supporter of the schools and am generally happy with
> Lena Whitmore school where my children attend school. I am, however, puzzled
> as to the concrete evidence you seek. The fact that our schools are barely
> above average in a nation that ranks poorly among countries with a fraction
> of its resources is not enough? Ok... I will give you another. How about the
> fact that I have to spend 2-3 hours a day supplementing my son's education
> so he actually is challenged? How about the fact that the majority of
> students graduating from high schools are not ready for college. How about
> the fact that most of my students at U of I complain about my junior level
> class being too hard when it is sadly watered down. How about the fact that
> we do not teach our children the skill of thinking. How about the fact that
> we spend a lot more money on education that those other countries that beat
> us but get much less for it. Do we not see that the ignorant children make
> for ignorant adults? Why do you think it is that foreign students breeze
> through American schools? Do we think that foreigners are just smarter? Are
> there superior brain genes abroad?
>
> I have found the earlier 1-5th grade classes move at a reasonable pace but
> they did not progressively increase the level of difficulty. My son is now
> having problems in 6th grade not due to its difficulty. No... in fact I have
> started him on far more challenging projects at home and he is excelling.
> His problem is that the substance is not there. At this age, there is a huge
> need for critical thinking and reasoning skills yet they are still working
> on generating index cards out of stories. They should be working on
> research, report writing, and presenting skills but they have to wait until
> high school for that... and even then a weak treatment. At some point we
> have to realize that we are not challenging our kids. They are getting
> bored.
>
> I am not suggesting that the English system is appropriate. I went to school
> in such atmosphere... I did not like it! However, we cannot continue to
> ignore discipline. We cannot continue to allow our children to be victims of
> mediocrity. We are not preparing our students for hard work. We think we are
> doing them a favor but in reality, we are committing a great injustice. They
> will have to compete in this increasingly global world and believe me
> friends... even our college graduates do not come close to those of the
> other countries. It is sad really, we are loosing the intellectual advantage
> we have due to laziness and apathy.
>
> Having said that I have to admit that I have known many dedicated educators
> at my children's school. I have mentioned before how fond of this school and
> its principle I am. This may seem like a contradiction but it is not. The
> problem is not our school system alone. The problem is with us as a whole.
> As long as we go on accepting mediocrity and being mediocre ourselves, we
> will be blessed with mediocre children! We, as a nation, are bringing up a
> bunch of mediocre, lazy, ignorant, unmotivated children. We are too busy to
> care about our kids. We are quick to blame the schools and the system for
> our own lack of parental fortitude. We treat our schools as a glorified
> babysitter and are amazed when the system fails. The fact is that our
> children are a reflection of us. If we are lazy unintelligent couch potatoes
> who sit in front of the TV for 4 hours a day we will be unlikely to have an
> intelligent, motivated, productive offspring.
>
> My purpose here is not to blame the schools, the parents, or the society. My
> purpose is to blame them all! Stop wasting money in the schools. Start
> challenging the kids. Get your face out of the damned TV and spend some time
> with your children. It all depends on your priorities. If you are self
> centered enough to not have time for your kids then do not expect them to
> turn out any different that you.
>
> I am sorry if this letter is harsh to everyone. I am sure I will be
> unpopular for this one but I guess that is not a big change. I seem to enjoy
> a strong level of contempt from most of the members of this forum. But quite
> frankly... I do not give a damn! When it comes to kids, I am all on their
> side! I am sick and tired of lack of vision and concern about our children
> in this country. I am tired of the children suffering for our stupidity. I
> am tired of people blaming others for their lack of motivation and
> dedication. I am tired of stupid power games in the governing bodies of this
> country, including the school board, which further erode the resources
> available to our children. I am sick of the parents who have their heads so
> firmly planted where it was not intended to be and thus utterly failing to
> accomplish their duty. Until that adult population of this country pull
> their head out of their (you know what) we will not change the education in
> this country... no matter how much money you throw at it.
>
> "Your brother in arms"
> Shahab...
> By the way, since I have been a source of annoyance to most of you in this
> forum and also since I have started working with my son in the afternoons
> after school I will be signing off this forum. I am sure there will be a
> great rejoicing in the land so I feel I am achieving two goods with one act.
> For those who have shown me kindness, I appreciate it. For those who taught
> me things, thank you. I feel that it is more important for me to spend time
> with my children than voice my un-welcomed and unpopular mind.
>
> I wish you all well and hope that Truth finds you,
>
> Shahab...
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Davis [mailto:jcdavis@uidaho.edu]
> Sent: Monday, November 12, 2001 7:01 PM
> To: vision2020@moscow.com
> Subject: Levy Comments
>
> I too am concerned with comments by French in the MDN and Danahy on the
> vision listserve, and am disturbed for several reasons.
>
> First, French calls for 'efficient' schools, based I suppose on some sort
> of efficient factory-production model. Well, we just can't do that very
> easily with people; especially given the mandate of American public
> education: a comprehensive successful educational experience for all
> students in a safe, non-threatening environment. It is no small feat to
> accomplish this task, given the multitude of variables our professional
> educators manage (ranging from learning styles and abilities to concerns
> over issues which socially impact their students). While I agree that
> there are some fiscal parameters that our district can and will examine
> from a cost-effective standpoint (technology, transportation, energy
> consumption, etc.) AND knowing that the majority of funds are committed to
> salaries I, and I am sure many others, are quite content with paying an
> additional tax of $.50 to $1.00 per day to ensure that we retain small
> class sizes and the supportive, nurturing environment that is enabled by
> such schools. Keep students in schools within their respective
> neighborhoods. . . and if we have some variation between schools,
> departments, and grade levels regarding class size, so be it.
>
> Second, Danahy claims that our schools are not effective. . . and even
> "stoops so low" (to use his words) to engage in accusations against a very
> professional group of individuals--yes, our community teachers. You state
> strong opinions, but they appear to be just that--baseless opinions, not
> positions supported by evidence. Speaking of evidence, where is
> yours? Even a shred? Have you interviewed and categorized all the parents
> and children who attend schools other than MSD? Do you examine test
> scores, both standardized and pencil-and-paper? Are you familiar with the
> post-graduate success rate of our students in business, industry,
> vocational programs or college? Are you at all familiar with what our
> children can do? Are you even remotely aware of the quality environment
> our children have in this lovely, provincial community? I suspect not. I
> am not even going to portray my children's experiences, although, suffice
> to say that it is far more positive than your account. . . AND my children
> had experience with MSD and a local private school. It seems as though you
> harbor some hostility regarding the teachers. . . yes, there is an apparent
> long-standing 'issue' between the MSD and trustees. . . but, it is time to
> grow up. I expect my current, future, and past trustees to be professional
> in every sense of the word. Resentment of the past can only lead to
> continued conflict in the future.
>
> I am proud of all of our community schools. . . ALL of them. They are
> staffed by well-educated, well-meaning, bright, articulate professionals
> who work hard to help us help our children be successful in any and all
> endeavors they choose. Do they make mistakes? Of course. Do
> I? You? Yes, we all do. However, it is our responsibility to learn from
> our mistakes and move forward.
>
> John Davis
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