Re: Gay California teachers 'come out' in classroom

[ltrwritr@moscow.com (Mark Rounds)]

Here we go again, jumbling up the issues so that emotion replaces reason. 

So here are the issues that I see in this post layed out one at a time.

The Joke was far more than potty humor as it deameaned health care
professionals and all HIV sufferers, many of whom have the desease for no
fault of there own.  It was indefensible and should be treated as a separate
issue.

Secondly you speak of judgement and rationality.   You can and must judge
your own actions on a continuing basis.  But when humans attempt to judge
others, they risk feeling superior and dehumanize the person they judge to
be less than themselves.  Take some time and read the parable in the Bible
about the Pharisee and the Sinner in the Temple for further enlightment on
this subject as I do not wish to get into a public relgious debate.

Thirdly, you speak of a moral compass and toss out a bunch of vague words as
if that defines it.  Others follow moral compasses too, and guess what,
they differ.  You must judge for yourself which one to follow but don't you
dare take on that responsibility on for me.  You haven't walked in my
moccasins and my decisions and their repercussions are wholely my own.

Finally you ask if I have lost the ability to judge.  Looking at the
discussion above, very obviously not.  But it is something that can be
abused and most people do, myself included, as we humans tend to do it far
too early in the process.  So since I don't know you and you don't know me
other than by a few electrons floating in each others computers, I would ask
that you didn't judge me until you do because you will find surprises and I
will not judge you for the same reason.  

The last and unspoken issue that started all of this is the issue of Gays
"Coming Out" in the class room.   My personal feeling is that the classroom
is not a place for teachers discuss who they have sexual relations with or
why.  That goes for heterosexuals and well as homosexuals and any other
flavor that might be out there.  Hopefully, a classroom is a place of
learning and scholarship where basic skills and facts can be presented to
children and again hopefully, they can learn them. 

In the work place, my concerns are also the same.  I want to relate to
people about the work at hand.  What they do after work is really none of my
business.   If, in a personal or social setting, someone wants announce that
issue, they can.  I won't be announcing my sexual activities though ....
probably too boring anyway ;-)  My point is that is shouldn't matter.
People's sexual orientation is just a small part of what makes them unique.

I have a few friends that I know are gay.  I have a few friends that I know
are heterosexual because, in both cases, they have made a point of telling
me, but for the vast majority of folks I know, I don't know their
orientation and I don't care.  I try to relate to them all as people and as
individuals.  I get surprised sometimes but that is part of life ;-)

I think this thread is getting out of hand so this is my last response to it.  

Mark Rounds


 

At 06:31 PM 6/8/02 -0700, Mike Rush wrote:
>'Judge not lest ye be judged'?  Everyone judges everything and everyone
>every day.  When was it that rational people lost the ability to 'judge' the
>difference between mass murder and jaywalking.  Has everyone lost the
>ability to see evil for what it is?  The joke may be potty humor, but those
>who attempt to follow some moral compas in life see that there are actions
>which are destructive, immoral and evil.  Ask yourself,   "have you lost the
>ability to judge?"
>
>Mike Rush
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Mark Rounds" <ltrwritr@moscow.com>
>To: <: vision2020@moscow.com>
>Sent: Friday, June 07, 2002 7:02 PM
>Subject: Re: Gay California teachers 'come out' in classroom
>
>
>> Phil
>>
>> The post that started this thread was appropriate for this kind of forum.
>I
>> don't want anyone, gay, straight or celebate discussing their personal
>> sexuality in the class room.  That shows a significant lack of judgement.
>>
>> The joke below also shows a lack of judgement.   People get AIDS from
>> tainted blood products, cheating spouses, sharing needles and straight
>> unprotected sex as well as gay sex.  I know of no one in the medical
>> profession that would be as insensitive as the joke below describes.  Even
>> if someone has made poor choices in their life, it is not the place of
>> health care professionals to judge, nor is it yours.  There is a rather
>> important book that reads in part "Judge not lest ye be judged".
>>
>>  Please refrain from that form of potty humor on this list serve.  There
>are
>> others where it is welcome.
>>
>> Mark Rounds
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >>John, excellent point and thanks for the enlightening article.  Our
>> >>politically correct environment is out of control and has been for quite
>> >>some time.  Unfortunately, our country is at a cross-roads regarding
>> >>sustainability and this is one example of its decline.  Brings to mind
>> >>something I heard the other day:
>> >>
>> >>Bob goes to his Dr. complaining of certain disturbing symptoms.  The Dr.
>> >>runs some tests and tells Bob, "I've got bad news, you have AIDS."
>> >>Naturally, Bob is pretty distraught and asks his Dr., "Dr. please help
>> >>me...what can I do?"  His Dr. responds, "Eat a pound of prunes, drink a
>> >>quart of unfiltered apple juice, drink a small bottle of tabasco sauce,
>> >>eat ten large jalapeno peppers, and top it off with some pickled
>> >>cabbage."  Bob say, "Dr. Will that cure me?"  His Dr. responds, "No, but
>> >>it may remind you what your rear end is for."
>> >>
>> >>Cheers and have a super weekend!
>> >>
>> >>Phil
>> >>
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>> >>Date: Sat, 1 Jun 2002 23:12:04 -0700 (PDT)
>> >>From: John Harrell <johnbharrell@yahoo.com>
>> >>Subject: Gay California teachers 'come out' in classroom
>> >>To: vision2020@moscow.com
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>> >>As a parent, I should get to decide whether or not I want my
>> >>children to be exposed to certain "activities." In the following
>> >>situation, I would say, "not in front of my children."
>> >>
>> >>---------------------
>> >>
>> >>Gay California teachers 'come out' in classroom
>> >>
>> >>By Ellen Sorokin
>> >>THE WASHINGTON TIMES
>> >>May 25, 2002
>> >>http://washingtontimes.com/national/20020525-93388851.htm
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>      A California public school district is allowing homosexual
>> >>school employees to "come out" in front of children in school
>> >>without obtaining parents' permission.
>> >>      A unanimous resolution allows teachers at the Hayward
>> >>Unified School District to talk openly about homosexuality or to
>> >>discuss their homosexual lifestyles with students during class.
>> >>The district's school board says such action is required under
>> >>the California Student Safety and Violence Prevention Act
>> >>of 2000.
>> >>      Teachers also are allowed to include homosexual figures or
>> >>role models in class and to read books with homosexual
>> >>characters such as "Heather Has Two Mommies."
>> >>      The case in Hayward is part of a growing national trend in
>> >>how school districts deal with homosexuality.
>> >>      Scott Lively, president of the Pro-Family Law Center in
>> >>Citrus Heights, Calif., said yesterday that his organization has
>> >>received calls from concerned parents in Massachusetts,
>> >>Vermont, Missouri and other towns in California during the past
>> >>several months.
>> >>      "It's a national campaign that is being pushed by homosexual
>> >>activists, and that campaign is to homosexualize the
>> >>public-school environment," Mr. Lively said. "One of the goals is
>> >>to create a voting majority within the high school students who
>> >>would be in favor of gay perspectives. These are activists who
>> >>got in positions of authority and use it to advance a selfish social
>> >>agenda, and, frankly, that's evil."
>> >>      School district officials said yesterday that the resolution is
>> >>about training students and teachers about tolerance and how to
>> >>provide a safe learning environment for homosexual students and
>> >>teachers. It's not about teaching students about homosexuality,
>> >>said Kim Hammond, the school district's chief administrative
>> >>officer.
>> >>      "We're not saying, 'Let's teach the students about
>> >>homosexuality,'" Ms. Hammond said. "What we're saying is,
>> >>'How do we accept individuals who are different from
>> >>ourselves?' Our school board is committed to maintaining a safe
>> >>learning environment for all of our students."
>> >>
>> >>{..snip.. see URL above for complete article}
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>__________________________________________________
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>>
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